Continue the discussion from class (which was our most popular so far) using the comments below. Consider the following questions which came up, and try to provide links in your responses: -What is privilege? What is racism? We talk about -What does it mean to blame individuals vs. "systems" for social problems? -How much responsibility do citizens have to obey authority figures? -Everyone agreed we should, ideally, take everyone as individuals. But is that possible? Why/why not? -To what extent is the history of slavery/segregation still with us? -Does political correctness have ANY value? If so, what? If not, how has it become so prominent? -Are all group treated equally in America today? Most racial minorities say no in surveys. Don't simply agree or disagree; consider where these perceptions come from. If you tend to disagree, try to see their point of view; if you tend to agree, try to see the point of view of white Americans who do not perceive things the same way. Also, please remember to be respectful! We all have different social and political views, but we are all part of the same class, community and country, and we need to remember that. If you really want to develop intellectually, you'll try to understand the mindset of those with whom you disagree, and always look for the bigger picture.
20 Comments
Biggs
9/29/2015 02:31:24 pm
Here's something I thought of today when we were discussing this subject: it seemed that many of your disagreements were ultimately less about race than about attitudes toward authority and institutions, which come down to questions of trust. Some of you seem to trust authority figures to do the right things more than citizens, and some of you have the opposite view. That's a fundamental difference in your developing political philosophies (although you might find if you think about it that your view really depends on the situation - people who want citizens to show deference to police don't always support TSA airport searches/scans, and people who tend to support citizens in disputes with police almost always see serial killers or terrorists as obvious exceptions).
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Willow Martin
9/29/2015 03:28:41 pm
Like I said at the end of class today, society tends to have this obsession with putting our faith into some "higher being." This belief is evident in almost all authority figures, whether it be God, or the police. We put our faith into such figures, believing them to be greater than average, superior in terms of morality and power. I'm not educated enough in religion to feel confident in making any statements about God, but in terms of the police and other human authority figures, humanity needs to learn to see them as what they are: humans, prone to the same flaws as us. When we see people as something greater than human beings, we put our trust into them in unreasonable amounts. Yes, we should be able to trust the police to protect us. It's their job. We do need peacekeepers in our society, to keep people from being harmed by others. But trusting the police to act as all-knowing judges, capable of deciding whether or not someone deserves to die, seems to me to be excessive. Moderation is key. In order to have a society that will function, we need to have some level of trust in each other, the police, the President, our neighbors, EVERYONE. Without trusting each other, we'd all live in constant fear. But we also need to reserve some of that faith in others. You can't expect anyone to be perfect in this world. Human beings are LITERALLY the product of an intricate series of genetic MISTAKES. We shouldn't treat each other like pure, Godly beings that are somehow better, purely because of our social status/ occupation. A king's crown is not a halo, and a police badge is not God's stamp of approval.
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Olivia Smelas
9/29/2015 09:48:15 pm
I completely agree with what Willow is saying about society's obsession with higher powers, however I don't think God and religion have to be involved all of the time. But, going back to the obsession with higher powers, let me put it in simpler terms: some humans trust other humans more because some other party of humans gave them a suit/badge/title. Just because a person has a title does not mean they are not prone to making human mistakes, just like Willow was saying. Humans make mistakes CONSTANTLY. And when an office-holder, or a police officer, or someone else with some kind of title makes an error, we have riots, protests, chaos ensues.We forget that they are people to. I am not AT ALL justifying unarmed police shootings, or any of that, it just boils down to the simple fact that people make mistakes, and one with a title is not any more or less prone to making errors and screwing up than any of us. That's what we have to realize. I don't think this involves a higher power, I just think that it is society's preconceived ideas about powerful, wise leaders of the past, and even the stereotypical fictional leader, reflecting the expectations people in power today are supposed to meet. I also wanted to bring up another point, which in Mr. Tucker's history class we had a discussion about. We were also working to define race, and at the end, we defined it as a social construct. "Race" is the product of society's preconceived ideas about a certain people based upon certain general characteristics. So racism can likely be defined as the hatred of another group because their general characteristics according to this group of people. Racism is basically people hating people because of this ideas of other people. This goes back to the fact that people make mistakes, I think the two ideas definitely relate.
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Biggs
9/30/2015 07:50:05 pm
So one of the ways we make mistakes is in our tendency to stereotype/generalize and then see that stereotype more than real people - and anyone is vulnerable to that. So our "social constructs" are not necessarily good pictures of what people are really like (this is what Judith Butler is saying about the social construct of "gender roles," too). This makes me think of how the Belgian colonists in Rwanda created a fake distinction between two "races" (hutu, tutsi) just by grouping people based on their height, length of noses, etc. And then the group the colonists disempowered ended up attempting genocide against the Other.
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Willow Martin
10/1/2015 04:59:38 pm
The deconstruction the social construct of race would be unnecessary, if all of humanity would be open to reconciling with the existence of racism, and then in addition be willing to strive to erase those prejudices from humanity. However, many humans cannot even take the first step UNDERSTANDING racism, let alone in ending it. Myriad people still do not recognize the existence of racism in the world and or racism's presence in their own mindsets. These people are one of the three main types of people I believe exist in terms of dealing with racism. The next type of person is the open racist, one who is aware of his bias, but still asserts to others and himself that his prejudice is somehow justified. The last category of people is comprised of those who are aware of racism in the world, sometimes even racism in themselves, and then strive to combat it (COMBAT it, not CONCEAL it). Unfortunately, the victories against racism achieved by the members of the last category are constantly countered by the actions of the other two types. The racists of our world, whether they be aware of their bias or blissfully ignorant to it, lubricate (a verb that I find especially appropriate, what with the subject of said verb being the oily slime of humanity) the gears and cogs of society's racism machine, as it consumes innocent individuals, and spits them out, mangled, sometimes even to the point of death.
Olivia Jordan
9/30/2015 03:45:04 pm
As I addressed in class, I do not believe that is possible to completely live in a harmonious and fair society. As human beings we always have this constant wanting to "fix" things or attempt to do what we think is best for everyone. A perfect example of this is the formation of authorities such as police officers or the judicial system. I DO NOT have any sort of hatred towards these two forms of authority, being that I truly feel they have good intentions. Its the individuals that enforce these laws in unjust ways, that I have a problem with. These people are there to be our equals and keep the peace in our society, not to act above us and use their "qualifications" to wreak havoc on innocent citizens for their personal entertainment. Again, I DO NOT believe this is the mindset of all authorities, just certain individuals. Another topic discussed in class was, "Are all groups treated equally in America today?" As an american, who has witnessed injustice to certain groups first hand, I can definitely say NO, not all groups in America are equally treated. Going along with my opinion towards individual authorities, some of these corrupt individuals use the race of a person to determine how they will be treated. If you are not able to contain your racism, while on duty that you certainly do not have the qualifications to be a "peace maker" in our society. I keep reiterating the word qualifications, because I am completely absurd by the idea of appointed people having the "qualifications" to determine the fate of another person, when truly as a fellow HUMAN BEING they are on the same playing field. As both Olivia and Willow have said, they are humans that make the same mistakes as everyone else.
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Biggs
9/30/2015 07:44:02 pm
So we are a species of busy-bodies, basically ... The Chinese philosophy of Taoism is all about realizing that our tendency to "fix" things throws the natural order out of balance, turning the harmony of the yin-yang into the hierarchy of the Empowered identity/the Othered identity.
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Melissa Velazquez
9/30/2015 05:27:29 pm
From the class discussions, i believe most people have the thought and belief that a different skin color or religion is bad for our world and find a way to execute them. For example, lately policemen are all over the media are portrayed attacking an other human based on the color of their skin. This is because they want to keep safe and peace and will stop anything suspicious. This is a form racism. We have seen young colored children and adults being killed for misunderstandings. They could be approached differently but get killed instantly. It makes it on the media. I think this is because of America's past, we assume that history may be repeating. For example, an Islamic person would be attacked at an airport. Or a Colored person getting attacked by simply walking on the streets. Skin color and religion does not define a person
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Biggs
9/30/2015 07:28:33 pm
So a concern with "safety" can turn into discrimination against members of a group seen as the "dangerous" Other?
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Erin Ostrowski
9/30/2015 07:20:17 pm
I totally agree with Olivia J. in the sense that it is impossible to live in a completely just and fair society because one group is always going to be looked at as above another. It is virtually impossible for the whole country to be able to hold hands and accept each other since there will always be a select few that think they are above others and refuse to think any differently. I believe that this is where the police brutality is coming from because, in my opinion, their badges are distorting their view of the job they must perform. The police as a system start to think that their badge gives them the right to use their privilege of having a gun whenever they feel afraid and the right to make assumptions about people. For example, with Tamir Rice, he was just a young boy playing in the street and instantly, the police officer took action and pulled the trigger. Like they teach us in school, think before you do, and the whole system is starting to fall into a slump of acting before thinking. That police officer could have easily walked a couple feet closer to see that Tamir had a dart gun, not a real one, and he could have asked him to stop or move somewhere else and a life would have been saved. Ultimately, this relates back to our reading from tonight that explains how people subconsciously think that some lives matter more than others. Most white people get the benefit of the doubt while our society still cannot get over this hurdle of being able to do the same for black people. It is actually pretty disappointing that it has been about half of a century since the civil rights movement and people still have it in their minds that white people are just more equal. Unequal does not mean one is better or worse but it means that one is accepted more than the other because they are the similar. Naturally, we can’t all be equal but we can take steps as individuals to not succumb to stereotypes about people who are of a different race (a task we may never overcome, unfortunately). Altogether, it is virtually impossible for everyone to be completely equal, but that does not mean there is a right to commit violent injustices towards another group for the sake of preserving one’s own.
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Will Spencer
10/2/2015 08:32:05 am
I can't wait to start this debate after reading some of these well written responses. Below I will list my answers/Opinions to some of Mr. Bigg's points he listed above, just to start things off. I dont know how the formatting works for this so bare with me on making the correct spaces between questions/answers.
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Will Spencer
10/2/2015 01:01:17 pm
Part 2/2
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Willow Martin
10/5/2015 06:21:03 pm
I also respectfully counter Will's last point by providing these very present examples of white supremacy's prevalence today, not just against blacks, but all non-white people in general:
Olivia Barkey
10/12/2015 02:17:27 pm
Will I would to respectfully disagree with you. I do not think that all races in America are treated equally. Racism in this country, I believe, is a very big issue. Even though we are not segregated by signs, we are segregated by people who believe that there is no issue and that everything is fine. And though there may not be laws written down on paper, there are many laws that I like to call "invisible laws". These laws are there- but not always seen. For example, it seems that when a black person is pulled over for speeding, police officers are A LOT more forceful with them, compared to what they might do/say to a white person.
Willow Martin
10/4/2015 05:07:06 pm
Okay, I am now going to respectfully disagree with some points Will made:
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Trey Soya
10/4/2015 07:29:39 pm
I would just like to say a couple comments with all do respect. If the U.S. changed the laws of obtaining guns, the process of buying guns would just become slower and have a couple more background checks. This would not guarantee that everyone does't get a gun. What causes mass shootings is the buyer's intentions, which most likely cannot be controlled. The Walter L Scott shooting occurred because Scott fled his car so the officer chased him, got into a fist fight and then Scott was shot. This was a heat of the moment decision made by the police officer, not the system. Getting shot in the arm or leg is not exactly the safest place to get shot. If the bullet goes through your emoral or brachial arteries you will die because of loss of blood in minutes. The hands and feet would be very hard to shoot especially while running. The cop was in a lose lose situation. I believe instead of firearms police should use pneumatic weapons (Air based guns; https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pneumatic_weapon) These weapons are able to strike painful blows but depending on the projectile it will not be deadly. Using these will prevent many shootings and police would still be able to catch the person they need to get without killing them. I believe that history is important and we have to learn what works and what doesn't works. If something doesn't work then we have to learn to forgive, not start chaos.
Biggs
10/5/2015 01:59:37 pm
Willow, how much responsibility do you think the individuals officers bear in the shootings you mention, as opposed to the system as a whole? I'm thinking of what Will said in his earlier post about his belief that we should focus on the individual at fault.
Biggs
10/5/2015 01:55:43 pm
Hmmmm. Don't individuals become who they are within social systems? It's difficult to say how much a person is influenced by their environment, especially if they have developed some kind of social problem of psychosis as you say. (This point applies just as much to people who blame the system entirely and don't consider individuals).
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Biggs
10/5/2015 02:04:04 pm
Trey, do you think there is any way to influence people's intentions? Some societies have more violence than others. Is that due in any way to culture? I agree that we could never entirely regulate guns (just like F451 couldn't totally ban books), but is it possible to create a kind of society that would encourage people to be less likely to attack each other?
Willow Martin
10/5/2015 05:47:49 pm
In response to Mr. Biggs, I believe that the social system of our world today has been shaped by history, and much of the prejudice and racism prevalent in our society exists as a result of the lasting effects of our nation's past.
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